Through the Looking Glass, and What Mandragora Found There

[Mandragora]

That's definitely the way it is, Toby. Pedos in prison are called 'rock spiders'--the lowest of the low.

Although... is it really what should happen? I mean, we have a justice system which mandates crimes and punishments--being raped in prison is an extrajudicial punishment which is not mandated. I think if we want pedos to be executed or even raped (using rape as a punishment doesn't really feel right with me--makes us like them), we should legislate for it and make it official.

I really dislike the concept of unofficial punishment.

However that's from my scholarly and objective perspective. I totally understand how you feel--I do feel a sense of satisfaction that they don't have an easy time in prison.

Ben, as for what's next... the thesis gets graded and I graduate, then we have it condensed into 5000-8000 words and we have it published in a journal. Before or after publication, we write up a covering letter and send the whole thing to Steven Conroy, Minister for Communications, and see what he has to say. Mmmhmmm.

And then, casting even further afield... I'll re-launch my idea to provide a dedicated service to the Police tracking online predators--hopefully my University will support this and make it a program, perhaps for students (valuable experience, looks good on resume etc.). Then who knows, maybe I can expand this internationally...!

[Mandragora]

Heh, do you have a character limit on posts? It went all weird and wouldn't let me type.

I was going to continue, on a personal level, I'm going to take it easier for a while and concentrate on my career. I'm also planning to re-learn accoustic guitar (focussing on classical music). And maybe catch up with the friends I've been neglecting :p

Anyway, I'm doing the final edits now. Submission next week.

Ben, you have a PM!

[Ben]

I feel that the justice system is fairly broken as it is. I dont really know what would be better, but having known some lawyers and having heard some horror stories I firmly believe in killing all the lawyers and finding some form of justice that works better.

Sadly if we give the judicial system the power I would like to give them the incompetents and th e corrupt would abuse it. If we give them less nothing would get done. Sigh, seems we are doomed to imprefection. The borg would be ashamed.

[Mandragora]

It's a good point, yeah. We are imperfect people living in an imperfect world; the social structures we create will always be imperfect.

Increasingly, the more I see of the justice system the more it seems to serve the wealthy. Money counts. Policing resources are aimed at what the wealthy fear (street crime, terrorism etc.) than some of the major problems such as white collar crime, child abuse, domestic violence... street crime is just visible.

*Sighs* it's up to us to try and make a difference, I guess. And we already are. Thios research project is small in comparison to everything that's going on--but it will save children's lives, either directly via the intel we have or indirectly by arming police with better behavioural knowledge. Just one case of abuse stopped is worth everything--and one prevented is overwhelmingly worth it.

It's funny, though... you and I aren't wealthy people. I mean, we aren't in poverty, but by the standards of the countries we live in, we're not wealthy. However it's us that end up sacrificing time, resources and money into this. Admittedly, my university made it all possible... However you gave your time and server (which you pay for), and I gave my time, most of my rec leave and flex time and other resources. Between us we've achieved something which police will use to catch online predators.

Makes you wonder what can be done if someone who was rich would bother about this sort of thing...

[Ben]

The middle class has always been responsible for change. The upper class is happy with how things are (For the most part), and the lower class does not have the resources to do much more then just survive.

It is also amusing because the wealthy have the least to lose from street crime. If they are carrying a few hundred dollars with them, no big loss. If a lower or middle person is carrying a few hundred dollars with them, then that could be the difference between eating for a week, or paying rent.

I like the idea of eliminating violent crimes, but some crime I do not understand why it is illigal. Drugs, Alcohol, Tobaco, those are the government trying to protect us from ourselves. Age laws make sense because children sometimes cant make proper decisions that will effect their lives, but adults should not be limited. I think it was part of the constitution of the USA to allow people control over their bodies. Ya... That lasted.

Protecting those who are helpless should be the primary focus of the law. Protecting property rights should be up their as well. Protecting us from ourselves should just be cautionary.

[Toby]

If anything knows anything about me I am a pretty radical liberal, borderline anarcho-communist. I am against the police, in fact, I would say I hate them so much when one of them dies a smile comes to my face. I have my own personal reasons as well as logical reasons for hating the police, which I doubt anyone on this board thinks very highly of the police either.

[Ben]

I like the idea of police, but I think that the practice has been corrupted as with most things in life.

I like the idea that if I were to be murderd their is a team of somewhat organized professionals who are dedicated to figuring out who did it and bringing them to justice.

On the otherhand, I really dont think that parking and j-walking tickets is a good use of their skills.

[Mandragora]

Eh, I have nothing against the police. Sure, there will always be police corruption, there will always be abuse of power and so on... but in the end we do indirectly vote on the laws that they enforce.

I've worked with the police twice now, in two different roles. The cops I've worked with have been just regular guys that do a frustrating, pretty shitty job on public service wages. It's easy to see cops as the faceless, uniformed 'Man', the authority to rebel against, but walk a mile in their shoes and see how it feels. They have to be dicks to us on the small things like jaywalking, so that other people like paramedics don't have to scrape us off the underside of someone's SUV, our family and friends don't have to view our ripped-apart corpses to identify us, the forensic pathologists don't have to dig through the bits to make sense of what happened when...

Cops know they have to be dicks. Sure, there are some that may enjoy this... but when I stop and put faces onto the uniforms, when I think about the two Senior Sergeants I sat in an office with, the Inspector who supervised me etc., suddenly it becomes a different story. I read somewhere about a cop who was put on traffic duty and felt like a dipshit giving people tickets for speeding, not wearing seatbelts and stuff... until he saw his first traffic accident and the charming way someone's spine was halfway through the back of their neck and the head was up a tree.

And some drugs, such as ice, should always remain illegal in every way. I do believe other drugs should be decriminalised.

So yeah. Toby, I can't tell you how to see the world, but when a cop dies in the line of duty the world is just that bit worse off. One lead not followed in time, one connection not made--one abducted child, one grieving family, one more corpse.

[Mandragora]

Although it must be noted that a corrupt cop is basically one of the most low-life scum you can find anywhere. It doesn't matter how many people he or she saved, whether he or she ran into a burning building for a kitten--when a cop takes a bribe, abuses his powers, dodges the law... that's an unforgivable sin.

I'm no fan of the justice system, not really... But to be a police officer is not like being a soldier. It's a responsibility to protect and serve, with intelligence, cunning, honour and integrity. It's a responsibility to be educated, to know the law inside out, to know what the 'rule of law' actually means, to be ethical and moral. Being a police officer means walking in the darkness of evil without becoming evil, avoiding temptation, being understanding and kind even amidst the worst pain, suffering, hatred and anger people can throw at you. It's having compassion while enforcing the law.

Police have to use force, be firm, and their duty calls for them to be dicks sometimes. It's not a nice, easy job. That's why I don't ever want to be a cop. I know my limitations.

Heaven fucking forgive the scum who put their uniform on, wear the badge, goes on duty and commits a crime. I certainly won't. Corrupt cops are worse than criminals, they're fucking pathetic. To take the oath to protect and serve society, to be the person everyone turns to when there's no-one else... the person who's afraid but is called upon to ignore their fear and walk into darkness and danger... that's a sacred oath. The uniform or badge is a sacrement, a visible sign of an invisible reality. Breaking that oath is one of the worst evils possible.

[Toby]

That's all nicely put, makes me think a little differently.. A bit. I just hate the system basically because so many of my friends have been fucked in the system and still continue to be every day. Silly fines over stupid reasons that continue to screw with them daily, kids being ripped apart from families for stupid reasons. It's happened to so many of my friends and family. The only part I see from the police are the dickhead parts, I'm kinda being biased... I think it's because I grew up in the hood, what?